That was one lame rim shot! Use caps at least!

Actually, I don't think it's a debate over money at all. That is a legitimate question, although I often wonder why no one really seemed to be asking it when we (and I use that pronoun loosely) decided to start an illegal war that is costing us billions of dollars.

It seems to me that the so-called debate is centered on who "deserves" health care and who doesn't. And to be more specific, it's about illegal immigrants. Now Max Baucus has added something to the finance version of the bill that says that illegal immigrants would not even be allowed to pay for health insurance. What's next? Are we going to prevent them from buying food too? Wouldn't it be better to let them buy into something and feed money into the system instead of costing us money in the emergency room? I mean they are here, and I don't really see anyone attempting to send them home, so shouldn't we actually try to relieve some of the financial burden they are placing on the system right now? Or maybe that is just too logical.

I am reminded of a really great line from NYPD Blue. Det. Sipowicz was going off on how foreigners were ruining the country and Det. Simone says "Meet Detective Sipowicz--the only native American Pole."

hrg

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32882064/ns ... alth_care/

45,000 people dead because of lack of healthcare. It seems to me that we should pay the freight on this. It's the right thing to do.

hrg

...not to mention the people who DO have medical insurance,and their claims for care are automatically denied; the insurance companies are hoping to make it difficult to get your claim paid, and that they'll wear you down and not have to pay. With for-profit insurance companies, it's in their interest to deny claims, stall approval for expensive treatments, and hope you die in the meantime. It's good for their bottom line. It's all about the profit.

It looks like its all abouth money ( not people ) Whe have a far better system overhere .

Because as long as you can be convinced that's what it is about, the news cycle will focus on that and racism and quit talking about health care. Guess what? Lardbutt Limbaugh and Beaknose Beck win.

If you watch the videos, most of the people at those rallies are about our age. They're the Boomers who didn't leave racism behind in the 60s. They never will. They will always be at the Beck and Call of the PR firms that are paid to manage outrage for the right and in the insurance companies. They will be used every time Obama proposes ANYTHING.

We are being baited and yes, we will be fooled again because that is what these firms do best. Meanwhile what will disappear? Health care reform. It will disappear down the swirling maw that is our outrage.

Why do you think Obama's spokespersons are on TV minimizing the racism? Because that issue serves their opponents and ours.

Eyes on the prize, my friend. Eyes on the prize.

Take a look at this video. Understand how they keep fooling us again and again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUY9ahSCMG0

Well, that's what I meant...hence the words "so-called". Unfortunately, I don't really hear anyone in Washington actually debating the issues. Instead, they are doing a lot of shouting and using the media to prey on people's baser feelings about who "deserves" health care, etc. And as long as that is all they are talking about (by design), then that is what the issue becomes for most people. It's hard to get people riled up about finance.

Suddenly the red herring becomes the actual issue, and while no one is paying attention, lots of people are suffering. Similar to W's second "election" when we all spent a lot of time screaming about abortion and family values while we quietly engaged in torture and illegal warfare. All a distraction.

All of that being said, I still believe that we should foot the bill for universal coverage for all. Anybody on here from the New York area will probably remember the old Russian Tea Room ad that used to be on local radio..."Slightly to the left of Carnegie Hall...". To paraphrase...I'm "slightly to the left of Ted Kennedy".

hrg

I agree. They are bears treating us like salmon and because we are driven to make the trip, they get takeout sushi for standing by the river.

As long as they are framing the conversation, it goes nowhere. I like Mrs. Obama's approach. She stays out of that discussion and shows the outcomes.

They are selling wonky. I want potatoes and tomatoes.

Who deserves healthcare ? Everybody in this world deserves healtcare . Thats my opinion.